Legislature(2007 - 2008)HOUSE FINANCE 519
04/08/2008 01:30 PM House FINANCE
Audio | Topic |
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Start | |
SB259 | |
SB254 | |
SB202 | |
SB265 | |
Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ | SB 243 | TELECONFERENCED | |
+ | TELECONFERENCED | ||
+= | SB 265 | TELECONFERENCED | |
+= | SB 202 | TELECONFERENCED | |
+= | SB 119 | TELECONFERENCED | |
+= | SB 259 | TELECONFERENCED | |
+= | SB 254 | TELECONFERENCED | |
SENATE BILL NO. 254 An Act extending the termination date of the Alaska regional economic assistance program; and providing for an effective date. REPRESENTATIVE PAUL SEATON, SPONSOR, explained that the committee substitute for SB 254 contains the entire purpose of HB 16, extension of the vessel base fishing limited entry system. HOUSE BILL NO. 16 "An Act providing for an effective date by delaying the effective date of repeal of the authority of the Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission to maintain the vessel-based commercial fisheries limited entry systems for the Bering Sea Korean hair crab and weathervane scallop fisheries, and the effective date of conforming amendments related to the repeal of those systems." HB 16 did not languish in Committee. It was introduced early with extensive hearings last year. Following discussions with the Department of Fish and Game & Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission (CFEC). He hoped to see seamless management tools in place for managing the coast of Alaska State waters. He wanted to see regulations in place. Senator Seaton pointed out the inclusion of two fisheries in the work draft. When it was adopted in 2002, there was significant statewide testimony regarding anticipated problems including "super consolidation. The hair crab fishery was closed two years before the temporary limited entry permits were granted. There is no hair crab fishery anticipated for the next three years. He referenced the scallop fishery permits that had been issued. Currently, there are only three boats that harvest 100% of the scallops in Alaska. There is a tax issue because the fishery has been consolidated too far and information is not available. There are only two Alaskan boats participating in that fishery. Both boats have testified that they would like to see the license period extended to five years. There is a sunset included in the bill. In the current plan, the ownership goes to the vessel owner and is the same system used by the federal government. The program would not terminate the 70% fisheries now occurring in federal waters. The federal water limited entry system will remain in place. Representative Seaton reviewed the temporary nature of the permits. He addressed how well the program worked for Alaska. He maintained that there needs to be a policy call on that fishery. 2:34:40 PM Representative Seaton continued, nothing in the legislation prevents the system from being in place in federal waters. The State recognizes that individual participants gain the rights and that it can be transferred, but no one else can enter the fishery. He maintained that there is ample time to go back and create a limited entry program based on the proposed deliveries. Historically, the Alaska fishery attempts to have participants, however, at this time, it is in the hands of only three. Those provisions have prevented many fishermen from participating on an economic scale. Representative Seaton emphasized that the Community Development Quota (CDQ) is an excellent program. The language of the bill would not prevent it but rather proposes monitoring a statewide program, maintaining fishing permits. Representative Seaton stated that there is no conservation issue attached to the fisheries, which is driven by the economics of participation. 2:39:33 PM Representative Thomas asked about the statewide boat displacement. Representative Seaton explained, there is no way to legally indicate that it is an Alaskan boat. The program displaces those boats so they do not have access to the fishery. He reiterated, there are only three fishing vessels in the entire fishery. Representative Thomas was concerned and asked if limited entry was eliminated, how the fleets would access an open fishery. Representative Seaton explained that the question is not whether the vessels could be excluded from Alaska but rather that they are receiving dollars from Alaska without coming to the State. He maintained that the program should go away. 2:44:00 PM Representative Nelson asked if the concern is with shareholders not fishing the vessel, yet receiving benefits from the resource. Representative Seaton indicated his concern with people who do not participate in the fishery, but actually "own" the fishery. He added that the program has constricted jobs available to Alaskans and that jobs in the fishing industry are removed through the program, which means a loss of jobs and opportunities to coastal Alaska. 2:45:27 PM Representative Nelson elaborated that the vessels are so large that no one in her village can actually afford to own one. Representative Seaton pointed out that some are only 75 feet and that the fishery does not have to be in a huge vessel. Historically, there have been smaller boats used in coastal towns. The consolidation included a vessel 123 feet long. He recognized that some coastal villages do receive small checks because a larger vessel is distributing those funds. He reiterated that the bill only addresses the scallop fishery, which fishes three miles within the coast. 2:48:18 PM Representative Thomas mentioned halibut fishing outside the coast of Alaska. He asked why there are complaints being voiced now, after so many years of being displaced. Representative Seaton explained that the personal limited entry system in Alaska is not consolidated and remains with that person, which does not guarantee that Alaskan people are actually participating in the fishery. Representative Thomas commented on the medical transfer permit restrictions allowed every three years. Representative Seaton spoke to the illegal practice of leasing a permit, noting the exceptions for medical emergencies limited to a specific length of time. He worried about one boat harvesting the entire fishery. 2:57:22 PM Representative Kelly summarized that the bill outlines two issues. One related to procedure and the other regarding the merits of the issue. He inquired which committee the bill should have been assigned to after the Fisheries Committee. Vice-Chair Stoltze understood that it should have gone to the House Resources Committee. Representative Kelly thought that forwarding the bill to the House Finance Committee was a "clear violation of the rules". He disagreed with incorporating it into an unrelated bill and the process it had followed. Co-Chair Meyer acknowledged that was a correct recap of Speaker Harris' position & what happened. 3:00:54 PM Representative Kelly asked to take public testimony on the issue. The sunset is being requested to be changed from five to ten years. He reiterated that the issue needs more attention and that he does not support the proposed ten year sunset. 3:02:06 PM Representative Gara interjected that consideration should have gone through the public issue and not have been determined in the Majority Caucus. He was uncomfortable with the process, maintaining that anything of merit should always be debated and that the committee process provides an opportunity to hear and deliberate issues. Representative Gara acknowledged he was confused about the issue. He was sympathetic for a piece of the State, which does not have a vibrant economy, yet has an interest in the fishery. He agreed that the power of the Alaskan fisheries should not be consolidated by huge outside companies. He acknowledged it is not a black and white issue. If the sunset was not extended, the Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission (CFEC) would have to determine who receives the vessel permits. If the sunset went into effect, the State would then have to determine who gets the permits to protect the resource. He asked if there was a way to determine permits distributed statewide and continue to have an interest in them given a preference. 3:06:21 PM Co-Chair Meyer commented that if the issue is important enough, it will surface for a public hearing. Representative Seaton interjected that the bill has been heard and given multiple hearings over the past two years. Representative Gara questioned the effect of the sunset on the vessel permitting. 3:08:58 PM FRANK HOMAN, COMMISSIONER, COMMERCIAL FISHERIES ENTRY COMMISSION (CFEC), JUNEAU, responded that CFEC would not be able to do anything if that happened. There is no way to take the vessel license program to an individual license program. There is no way to go backward except to go "way back in time" in the last ten to fifteen years. In the last five years, since the vessel license program has been in effect, the fishery has been limited to the vessels participating. To establish a limited entry system, the law clarifies the need to look back to four years experience and then choose from those participants. At the end of 2008, there is no population to draw on, except the vessel participating. The traditional method determines that those fishermen recently fishing get the most points. Mr. Homan added that in 2002, when the Legislature allowed the system for these two fisheries, it had been studied for five years prior at the Department of Fish and Game, attempting to determine a way to use the individual permitting system that identified the conservation of the fishery. There could be too many fisherman eligible to apply and the resource is fragile. The idea was presented to the Legislature, who debated and studied it. The Legislature allowed the exception to the general rule. He clarified that there is no way at this time to prevent non residents from participating. 3:14:00 PM JOHN HILSINGER, DIRECTOR, COMMERCIAL FISHERIES DIVISION, DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND GAME, advised that the Department supports the limited base entry system because it provides for conservation of the resource. If it is determined to return to the entry system, the Department has developed a management plan that will work if there is not much entry into the fishery. It is unknown how many people would come into that fishery if it was open entry. He reiterated that the Department is attempting to develop a plan, which provides the necessary conservation of the resource. The Division will need to divide the scallop beds into a State and federal waters portion and manage each section separately. The boats would have to register. The vessels would loose flexibility where they could fish. There are many questions regarding how the system would work in the open entry system. Mr. Hilsinger noted that fishery is a voluntary cooperative. The economics of the fishery is small, harvesting approximately ½ million pounds of scallops. He noted that there is 100% observer coverage except in the Cook Inlet. He added that most of the scallop beds are in federal waters; there are only three that cross over. There are only three places where a State water boat could fish. 3:18:58 PM Mr. Hilsinger commented that if there are regulations that are too restrictive, the fishery could become uneconomic for everyone. That is not the intent of the Division. The intent is not to have different regulations inside and outside the three mile limit because of enforcement difficulties. He offered to answer additional questions of the Committee. 3:19:39 PM Vice-Chair Stoltze asked if the Department had initiated the discussion regarding emergency regulations. Mr. Hilsinger replied that the preference was to maintain the vessel base limited entry system. 3:20:38 PM Representative Hawker asked if the Limited Entry Commission and Commercial Fisheries Division support the language proposed in the bill. Mr. Homan stated that the Limited Entry Commission does. Mr. Hilsinger added that the Commercial Fisheries Division, Department of Fish and Game, also does. Representative Hawker inquired about the term position of each agency. Mr. Homan responded that the original intention for the agency was to make the vessel license permanent for the two fisheries. Mr. Hilsinger echoed comments made by Mr. Homan. Mr. Homan addressed consolidation issues. He stated that in 2002, the Legislature wrote into law [AS 16.42.450] that CFDC would establish regulations to avoid consolidation; that has been accomplished. The cooperative nature of the fishery is a result of that mandated legislation. 3:23:17 PM Representative Kelly interjected previous discussion regarding a way to determine bill management, which the public can understand. He did not intend to change his position on the legislation. 3:26:43 PM Representative Hawker MOVED to ADOPT Amendment 2, Page 1, Line 3, after "system", inserting "for the Bering Sea Korean hair crab and weathervane scallop fisheries". Vice-Chair Stoltze OBJECTED. Representative Hawker explained that the amendment provides "title tightening". Vice-Chair Stoltze WITHDREW his OBJECTION. There being NO further OBJECTION, it was adopted. 3:27:39 PM Representative Foster MOVED to REPORT HCS SB 254(FIN) out of Committee with individual recommendations and with the accompanying fiscal notes. There being NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered. HCS SB 254 (FIN) was reported out of Committee with a "do pass" recommendation and with new zero note by the Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission and fiscal notes #1 & #2 by the Department of Commerce, Community and Economic Development. AT EASE: 3:29:11 PM RECONVENE: 3:33:46 PM
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